Hey, Green Junkie!
In today’s episode, I am introducing you to Camille Lee, the founder and owner of Wear Em Out Tees.
Camille is here to talk about her game changing company that is helping to combat the effects of fast fashion and educate us all on how to fall in love with sustainable clothing.
She is a big advocate for the environment and has built a business rooted in the belief that we all possess the largest power in the world to create change with our daily choices.
I am so excited to bring her to you all today and hope you are as inspired as I was.
In this episode we will discuss,
- How Camille is changing the way we buy clothes
- Behind the scenes of Wear Em Out Tees
- Easy ways to avoid fast fashion
- The power of choice and how you can create real green change
You’ll discover that and so much more in this episode.
If you love this podcast be sure to leave a review and share a screenshot of this episode to your IG stories. Tag @greenjunkiepodcast so I can shout you out and publicly say thanks.
Thanks for listening and being here.
Your green bestie,
Hang With Camille:
Snag 1 on 1 Green and Sustainable Coaching with me
Follow me on Instagram
Follow me on Twitter
Come join the Green Junkie Facebook Group
Become a Green Junkie Insider and gain access to bonus content
Produced by: Alecia Harris
Music By: Liz Fohle
TRANSCRIPT FOR EPISODE 30
Stephanie Moram 0:07
Hey, Green Junkie. I'm your host Stephanie Moram, and today I have the pleasure of speaking with Camille Lee, who is the founder of an online circular t shirt brand called wear em out tees, which is a black owned business. The company was created for two main reasons to help keep t-shirts away from the landfill, and instead circulating within the economy, and to divert funding from fast fashion brands who are unethical in their business practices. All T- shirts are pre loved and are screen printed with original graphics. So before we get started with Camille, please subscribe to the Green Junkie podcast on whatever platform you're listening to.
Stephanie Moram 0:50
So welcome Camille, thank you so much for being here. It's such an honor to have a conversation with you. So let's dive right in. I would love for you to tell the audience who you are and how you got started on your sustainability journey.
Camille Lee 1:05
Hey, Stephanie, thank you so much for having me on your podcast. This is amazing. And I'm so happy to have this conversation with you. Because, as you know, the past couple of years, it's we may have lost that, you know, hearing someone's voice and just interacting with others. So I'm super happy to be here. Thank you.
Stephanie Moram 1:25
Camille Lee 1:27
So as mentioned, my name is Camilla Lee. And I run a pre love to circular fashion t shirt brand called wear em out tees. And my sustainability journey started, I would say a little bit in high school a little bit in college, which is as far as fashion goes, I used to work in retail, like a big chain retail store. And I friggin loved it. Like I loved it. I loved seeing new clothes come in, and I loved folding clothes and hanging clothes and just being surrounded with clothes. I I never knew that I would actually end up doing this in the future. If you would have told my former self Camille, you're going to run a a fashion clothing brand, I would have been like I'm not it. But I would go to the thrift shops because I love that I love thrift shopping. I think there's so much value to be had when you are purchasing clothes, from thrift shops, app shops, resale shops and things like that. And I would find a lot of times and you may have experienced this to Stephanie, like you see stuff at their shops that is new with original tags. So it makes you wonder like, someone you know what I was watching a super old episode of Project Runway last night, actually. And I used to friggin love that show. I would watch it and I would know how much time and effort went into designers designing clothes, and to see someone's thought process end up at the thrift shop never, never sold never, you know, never making it into our economy and still with the original tag that just like oh man, what a waste. That sucks. You know, your hard earned work has ended here. And in it's original, quote unquote, form. So I thought, You know what, there's got to be a better way. Like, how can we maybe slow down the this process? How can we like continue to keep some of these things in a circular fashion and just keep them in the economy so that it's not like, oh, we designed it and then it goes straight to the thrift shop like that. That's insane. And I just thought, you know what, there's got to be a better way. What part in this whole process can I play? What part what I enjoy participating in? So that's how the thought process all began.
Stephanie Moram 4:21
And could you maybe explain to the listeners like what exactly Wear Em Out Tees is? Like what makes those T shirts more original and how do you take old T shirts and create you know upcycle them into better T shirts?
Camille Lee 4:37
For sure. Yeah, so the inventory acquisition process is pretty fun. That's basically just me for now. I go into the local thrift shops and I find blank T shirts. And I make sure that they are in good condition, they would take a graphic well. It must contain you know, certain types of cotton, it must involve some type of cotton. And I just look and I'm looking for shirts that I would love or I really find that someone else would love. And that's one of the one of the things I really liked about working in retail. Like, you know, sometimes it might be difficult shopping for ourselves, but we can shop for a mom or sister best friend really well, like, oh, you would look so good in this and so I get a little giddy, I guess you could say. When I'm grabbing our inventory, and quite the opposite of like, anyone just, you know, starting up a t shirt brand, I can't just order 10,000 T shirts from some faraway country and have them delivered to my front doorsteps and start the brand that way, so it's a very slow process. So every shirt is hand selected, painstakingly selected by me. And that is how we end up with inventory that we have. And because of that, that is how they end up being completely different. Like every single shirt is different, because like I just mentioned before, like, I can't just order a pallet, a truckload full of T shirts and, and have it delivered to my doorstep and still think that I'm doing something in the circular fashion world, that's quite the opposite. So that's what makes it unique, you know, every single shirt, whether they have the same graphic image printed on them, every single actual shirt is different. They're all one of a kind.
Stephanie Moram 6:40
And so what you're doing is you're taking 50 T shirts, and then the print that is on the t shirt, is it your original design? Do you work with artists? Like how does that design now get onto the t shirt?
Camille Lee 6:54
Yeah, so I actually work with a local artist. And it's, it's really cool, I have a concept and I say, I want this one to be this, I want some greenery or I want some, you know, there's a story behind each image that does make it to the front of the shirt. And I have no skills in that area. Like, you know, we all have our thing, right? Like, we all have our thing, and that is not my thing. So I'm fortunate enough that I get to like, see revision 1-2-3. And, you know, and get it to the place where I think someone would really, really appreciate it and love it.
Stephanie Moram 7:34
I like the idea that you work with like a local artists to get like your concept out, I really, really like my husband owns well just sold his company, and they work with local artists, because he does printing on cans. So they work with some local artists that help to create imagery for like, you know, the beer companies and a kombucha company. So I really appreciate that, you know, you're working with like a local artists that can, you know, put your, like, use their creative side, so you can get everything, like so I really, really enjoy that I really like that about your T shirts. And I really love that you you know, go thrifting and you're looking at this t shirt, wow, that would look great on somebody and with the image that I've created, and you know, you really are, it's really unique T shirts. And that's what I really love about your brand is that each one is unique might have the same design on it. But the t shirt itself is like different. So I guess my question is like, how long does it take you? You know, you go through once a week thrifting you're like today is thrifting day, I'm gonna go to 15 thrift stores and find all my t shirts or is it like I go every day? Like what is your kind of your procedure to find those T shirts? Do you also have like friends and family that might have t shirts and you take donations as well? What does that look like when it comes to finding the T shirts?
Camille Lee 8:52
So you may or may not know this, but I recently relocated from the Chicagoland area into the Dallas, Texas area. And so what I would do previously is I have a like a circuit, right? So I hit this one, this one this one and kind of do a circular trip that brings me back home at the end of it. And I don't like going with others. I mean I can and I know that's like a big like, of course you want to go shopping with your friends but I'm using now the business side of my brain. So I use some sort of like blinders on concentration when I'm going through a theme and it may take several trips and it takes quite a long time. There's quite a lot of time and effort put into finding shirts that are good enough so you know good enough to make it into our our inventory. And honestly Stephanie, I might go to one one place and I'll pick up I'll walk out with three shirts. I'll walk out with three shirts. I can't just grab every single shirt off the rack, because again, they're all unique. And we're talking about thrifting. Right here, instead of like going to a big box, you know, fast fashion brand. And in doing that, so I might walk out with three that are good enough. And so I go to the next stop, and I might walk out with four that are good enough. So imagine, you know, just trying to get the inventory up to 50, or up to 75, or 100. It takes quite a long time. So as far as your question about, do I take donations, I haven't yet no one's offered, one person offered to do that. But it's not something that's common for the business.
Stephanie Moram 10:43
No, just wondering, because sometimes, you know, people, you know, do their spring cleaning, they do their fall cleaning, and they have all these T shirts, and the other end up in a landfill somewhere. Or they donate them to a thrift store, or they donate them to a nonprofit. So I was just wondering if that was ever going to be part of your business model where like, you don't have to necessarily like drive all, like go all over the country to find them. Right? I would just say if like, say you had families or friends where hey, I have like a white t shirt that's in good condition and might fit into what you mean. I was just curious if that was something that you did,
Camille Lee 11:15
You know, I would never, I don't think I would ever turn turn that offer away, right? Because I kind of know what happens if it goes to the thrift shop, the chances of it being picked out by someone else within the timeframe that they like to turn around their inventory to, I would never turn it down. So if they're shirts that are in good condition, we can definitely, you know, find some some way to work that out.
Stephanie Moram 11:44
That's great. And so we're talking about T shirts and how you wanted to kind of use old thrifted T shirts and make them new again, with your prints. So I'd love to talk about how the decisions we make as consumers affect more than just us right? So I could talk about fast fashion all day, every day. To just have that conversation, like what are your thoughts about, like the decisions as consumers we make or affect just more than us? Right? And I would love to just kind of talk about that and how we can use our power of decision making for the greater good, and we can make better choices?
Camille Lee 12:18
Absolutely. So one of my favorite freedoms, as a citizen of you know, North America, the U.S. is the freedom to choose the freedom to choose. And we wake up every morning and we can make a decision, am I going to have a doughnut for breakfast, or am I going to have, you know, a green smoothie, you know, like, we have the power to make a better choice, it may not be the most pristine, you know, perfect choice, but we have the ability to make a better choice. And so I've just, if we can talk about the the huge, and the very big goal I have, it would just be to completely divert all funds out of fast fashion brands, as far as, as far as graphic tees go and bring them into the Wear Em Out Tees fold. Because we have the power we have the power to choose and to drive down the demand for fast fashion, we have the power to drive down the demand for unhealthy choices or not as healthy choices. So we really have this amazing freedom to do this on an individual level. So it's, it's something that feels amazing. You know, when you go grocery shopping, and you put all green veggies or you put all zero or low waste items on the conveyor belt, like, come on, you feel like a boss, you have to say like, you feel like a boss. It's a it's a boss feeling like yeah, I'm getting healthy today. Or, you know, yeah, I made a better decision instead of going here. I went here instead of choosing that I chose that intentionally. So yes.
Stephanie Moram 14:15
Yeah. And I agree it's making that choice. You know, sometimes people are gonna buy fast fashion because that's just where they're at right now. But if they do make that choice to buy a fast fashion t shirt or a fast fashion item, it's use that item as long as you possibly can not have a trend, right, like, oh, I bought this really cool shirt that I'm going to wear for six months because it was trending that was not trendy. And I'm trashing it or going to a thrift store. It's to lose that item as long as you can. And if you are in a position to afford ethical and sustainable brands, then slowly start to make those choices. I'd love for you to touch on. You know, we talk about like the decisions we make. So going beyond just the decision, like how does it affect other people? You know what I mean? Like so someone buys In fast fashion, like, if you buy something fast fashion like a T shirt, okay, I got a $5 T shirt. That's great. I was cheap. But yeah, what does that T shirt actually represent? You know, from an ethical standpoint, from a sustainable standpoint? Can you maybe just touch on that a little bit?
Camille Lee 15:18
Yeah, absolutely. So I used to be one of those people, those people who like, yeah, $5 this or, you know, $8 that, we were like, Okay, well, we were all first of all teenagers. And then we were all in our 20s. And so we kind of fell into this loop of, oh, I can't wear that today, because I wore it on Tuesday, and so and so already saw me wearing it. And I think if I could just touch a little bit on like, a minimalist point of view of no one's paying attention to what the heck you're wearing, no one is paying attention. Everyone is so self absorbed into what it is they're doing, how they're trying to move their own lives forward. And just, you know, no one's paying attention. So it's just easy, it's easy to make a decision to say this versus that and a $5 T shirt. It's great. However, it's also horrible, because certain very large brands are basically using enslaved women of color and men of color, just men and women in general in actually constructing the clothing, not in the US Well, partly in the US, but mostly for other nations that they are sewing per piece. And they're getting paid per piece and what they're getting paid is pennies, pennies to the to the dollar and the majority of instances, how can you live on that? You? The answer is you cannot, you cannot afford to pay for daycare for your child, you cannot afford to pay for groceries and just the most basic human needs that we have. And I think there's such a huge block or gap in between the output and the input. So the output is Whoa, I bought a $5 T shirt. Right. But what we don't realize as people who shop, people who buy things, is that what did it take in order to get to that $5 t shirt? Like who is paying for this in the end? And unfortunately, a lot of people are paying for this in the end.
Stephanie Moram 17:40
Yeah, and I agree. It's like people, like you said, yeah, got the $5 T shirt, but right, there has to be profit for the company somewhere in there. And one has to make it, they have to buy the materials, like there's just all these layers, and I don't think people realize is like that $5 t shirt, like, someone wouldn't might have been paid $1 to make that T shirt. You know, I don't know how I'm not gonna say the exact moment. I don't know. But yeah, yes, that big corporation has to make a profit. That's what their bottom line is make a profit. So a lot of these big companies, you know, they're exploiting workers in other countries. And then these people who are making these T shirts are not even making a living wage, like you said, you know, so it's just, I think it's just educating people. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, what? Yeah, what goes behind a fast fashion brand? Like, you know, just be more mindful of your choices, you know, like, we're not going to all change overnight. You know, I, I, you know, I've been living this lifestyle for about 12 years. But before that, I shopped at all the big name brands bought all the stuff, I wanted all the deals, you know, and then I realized, like, hey, I might be saving money, but at the expense of somebody else.
Camille Lee 18:54
Stephanie Moram 18:57
And I just, that's what I just realized, you know, and like you and many other people that, hey, I can make better choices. Oh, yeah, I can make better choices when it comes to my consumption. So I love that you've created this brand, where you're diverting T shirts that someone may or may not buy, and then literally upcycling them into something better. So people now have these really great T shirts and unique T shirts.
Camille Lee 19:24
Camille Lee 19:26
Yeah, well, yeah, thank you so much. It's, it's a very cool feeling to know that you own one, like no other. You know, that's what that's what the art industry is about. It's right. We have one Mona Lisa, we have one you know, one piece of amazing art. And just to know that, like I have this one and no one has this one in the world. No one has this exact same T shirt. And that's kind of fun. That's kind of cool.
Stephanie Moram 19:57
So on the top topic of you know, we're talking about sustainability, I would love for you to share with the audience I know, we talked, we, you know, obviously touching on fast fashion and consumption. But if somebody is like new to sustainability or even just like getting like getting started, like, what do you think that an everyday person can do to make a difference when it comes to living more green living more eco friendly and sustainable?
Camille Lee 20:23
Yeah, I mean, for all your listeners, they know about your life. Please know about your, your values, and your you know, you really put the, the ideas out there, and just the options like, you can make a better choice. You know, and if you're so torn about this versus that, make the better choice. And if you're not in a place where you're able to make a better choice, okay, maybe you just need some time. So don't choose at all make no decision.
Stephanie Moram 20:57
Right? And, you know, yeah, and I agree, and it's no set consumption thing. And I was talking to somebody else this week. And one thing that I just noticed a lot is people go to Pinterest, and they go to Instagram, and they seem like this eco perfection. And to really be sustainable and to be eco friendly is actually it's not perfection, it's your house isn't going to look like Pinterest, right? Because you have so much to get it to look like that, you know. If you want jars, use the jars you already have. You know, if you want a t shirt, and you want it for a Halloween costume, don't you don't have to go in and buy a new one. Yeah, go thrifting.
Camille Lee 21:41
Yeah, there's a couple of different options. Yeah.
Stephanie Moram 21:47
And when it comes to like, say, fashion for you. So thrifting is an option. Right? Like, what are other places? You know, somebody is like, you know, I don't want to buy new all the time. I you know, looking for secondhand, what are some some places that that you know, maybe people can go to that you say yeah, it's a really great place to thrift. It could be online. I know Facebook Marketplace is where I hang out a lot.
Camille Lee 22:10
Oh my gosh, yes. Oh, my gosh, I love that place. I'm looking at patio furniture. Right? Well, not right now. But yeah. So I mean, if you're looking for graphic tees come my way. But there are there, there are a lot of options, you can swap, there are events for swapping, people bring their things that they love, but they just for whatever reason, it's not their style, they no longer fit into it, they only wear it once for a special occasion, they don't see themselves wearing it. Again, there are swap events, I've not yet been to one, but I can't wait to go to one. So you can do it. That way you can hold a swap party yourself with all your friends, like just get all your girlfriends together, you know, put out some apps and and have a you know, a swapping social just get together and connect that way. There are also online platforms and online retailers as well that offer pre loved clothes, everything from blazers down to belt buckles, you know everything soup to nuts. So there are plenty of options.
Stephanie Moram 23:24
Yeah, and I love this swapping thing. Because it could even be like, you go through your closet for spring cleaning. And you see a couple of things. You know, you could even just call up your friends and be like, “Hey, I have like a couple of pieces of clothing I'm just not wearing anymore. And if you like them next time you come over, you can look at them. And if you don't like them, then that's okay, too.” You know what I mean? They can even be as simple as that. And I also wanted to mention, like, I know a lot of people often say like, well, I like high level brands, right.
Camille Lee 23:58
Stephanie Moram 23:59
You know, I want the Gucci, I want the Chanel and I want all those reins. It's right, I can still do that and be sustainable. Right?
Camille Lee 24:08
Yeah. And spend a lot less money.
Stephanie Moram 24:11
Oh my gosh, yes. And so if you're the type of person that you're like, I want, you know, those big name brands, you can go get, I've been just looking for sunglasses on Poshmark. And they're like a third of the price in really good condition. You can find those things. So if you're someone that's like, I want those big name brands, you can find them pretty much new for half the price so you can still live sustainably and buy brands that you want.
Camille Lee 24:40
Absolutely. I think people forget that. I think they think oh, I'm going thrifting I'm gonna get like, crap. Yeah, I'm gonna get like, yeah, brand that's gonna fall apart in five minutes. It's like no, you can actually get some really good stuff.
Stephanie Moram 24:55
And the second thing I want to mention is, you mentioned a couple minutes ago that some people were stuff once for an event. You can't discount renting. If you have an event and you need a really nice dress or suit, and you know you're going to wear it once, rent it, you're going to save money, right? And also wear it. So I actually, before the before I was wasn't traveling, when I was traveling a lot more, I went to a couple of events, and I found out some found some rental places. And when I landed, I went directly to the rental place, I had an appointment already set up, I went for an hour found the dress, I needed work to my event and then brought it back. And I didn't have to bring it on the plane. I didn't need it. And there were dresses that I would never wear again, super fancy, like really nice dresses, and it just may save money. And I also didn't go to the store and buy something new for the sake of buying something new.
Camille Lee 25:58
And then to just have it sit in your closet for all of eternity.
Stephanie Moram 26:02
Right, exactly, exactly that. So there's just so many ways that we can still get really nice stuff and save money. And I think that's a misconception when people talk about sustainability or green living or eco friendliness is that it has to be expensive. And I feel like it's the opposite. Doesn't have to have. It doesn't have to right.
Camille Lee 26:26
Hmm, you're absolutely right. You're absolutely right. We all we all have, you know, prom dresses bridesmaid dress? Like, what exactly does one do with those after the event has taken place? So yeah, 100% of what you said rent it, find a place rent it or borrow your friends or borrow your mom's or your sisters or your cousins.
Stephanie Moram 26:54
And it comes back to what you said, when people don't notice. Like, right? The last two years, I'm going to be honest, I've been wearing the same like three pairs of leggings for the last two years. Well, you and everybody else. So and like if you go to my Instagram, you'll probably notice it's like the four same sweaters that are in like every one of my reels. And I'm like, I'm just circulate through them. Because I'm like, I don't really care if you notice I'm wearing this. And we're in the purple Patagonia sweater, my organic one. I'm wearing a gray sweater and also an organic sweater I bought. And then there's other black sweater and I have a couple of others. And I just keep wearing them. And I'm like, if anyone cares, and they're definitely in the wrong spot. Right. Right. They're hanging on the wrong part of the internet.
Camille Lee 27:44
Yeah, yeah. And that's one thing. I think that's a mindset thing, too. Like, I think the quote is something like your clothes are the least most interesting thing about you as a person, the least. What's most important is you as a person, your personality, your characteristics, your, your excitement, of just about living life in general and living, you know, the best life possible. So, you know, your clothes are the least most important.
Stephanie Moram 28:19
And I think a lot of this comes from, you know, the, all the the fashion influencers where they're constantly promoting this over consumption, and they're constantly wearing different outfits. And I think that's where it comes from a lot of the time or like you mentioned before that, you know, when you're in high school or in college, I can't wear that I just wear that yesterday. And I think people are starting to be like, realize, it doesn't matter if we wear the same shirt 20 times in a row. You know, if I wash it, you know, or right matter if I'm wearing the same leggings, like it really truly doesn't matter. And people that care their people.
Camille Lee 29:00
So people who care Lord, they they need fulfillment and other areas of their life.
Stephanie Moram 29:07
Right. And it's a change. And I think social media now is really starting to flip that switch of you know, using Instagram, like, you know, five years ago or even three years ago was very, like aesthetics right? Like, everybody needs to look perfect, blah, blah, blah, blah. And now there's this like evolution happening where no, it doesn't have to be perfect. You can wear the same thing over and over again. And I think it's, it's changing and I think that's all we need when it comes even to sustainability like you don't have to have the Pinterest perfect kitchen with all the matching mason jars and perfect. This It's like no, you can just like I mentioned before, use the jars you already have. And I think it's now starting a lot of sustainability people and green living that advocate for these things are really starting to push, push that like it doesn't need to be perfect. Right, right. And even non sustainability people even, you know teaching about social media, it's like, this doesn't need to be perfect. Just get right out, get your message out. And that is the most important thing. Who cares if you're wearing the same sweater and shirt, just get your message out. Right, right. And I think that's what's starting to change on social media.
Camille Lee 30:17
And that's amazing because I am guilty. Like, I look at Pinterest, and I'm like, Oh, look at that pantry. And then you look at your pantry. And I'm like, This isn't like like that. But I think we you and I have had this conversation on Instagram. At some point. I'm like, I definitely have had this conversation with someone else. I'm like, I buy this salsa that I really like, because I love the jar now. Am I just buying salsa just to get the darn we eat chips and salsa over here. Okay, so, and I'm just not that. I'm not that, at that point in my life where I'm making my own salsa. Not yet. So, you know, do I choose the one where I like the jar the best? Okay, yeah, I do. But, you know, that's again, my choice and my prerogative, I'm not just fine for the jar, dumping the product out that's on the inside of it. And using the jar that makes no sense.
Stephanie Moram 31:17
Nobody is you know, I for a long time, I was buying a certain spaghetti sauce. Now. We make we I make our own spaghetti sauce. But for a long time, we had all these jars. And they're really nice mason jars. And now there are smoothie cups are water glasses, and they're they're nice mason jars. So there's just you know, we could talk about reusing glass jars, probably for an hour. But I and I just, you know, at the end of the day, I think the message you're trying to convey is the same one as me, it's just like, it doesn't have to cost money a ton of money to live green.
Camille Lee 31:54
And use what you have.
Stephanie Moram 31:56
Yeah, and use what you have. And I think that's like, the main message is like, use what you have. When it comes to sustainability. That's like the most sustainable thing that you can possibly do.
Camille Lee 32:09
So 100% Agree. No, I was just gonna say 100% agree, you were talking about, you know, wearing your leggings. And we're in your hoodies. And I think that's the entire world in the past two years seriously, like, you get up you get the you know what this is comfortable, I'm gonna wear it again, and wear it until it basically falls apart. And that's how the name of our company came together, Wear Em Out, wear them, wear them wear him out where until they fall apart. And then we can think about downsizing and other alternatives.
Stephanie Moram 32:46
Oh, 100% agree with that. 100% That's when like the very beginning of this conversation, if you do buy fast fashion, because that's where you at. That's where you're at. And it's where it until it's no longer wearable. And that will be also sustainable, because you're not buying a new shirt every five days, like everybody, you know. So I love that message. Before we close up, I would love for you to let everybody know where they can find you on social media and like what your website is, so people can find you.
Camille Lee 33:18
Sure, absolutely. So our website is Wear Em Out Tees dot com and so that's Wearemouttees.com and then I'm also on Instagram and Facebook under the same name @wearemouttees and I just started to tik tok but that that's gonna take some time to build because I'm like, What am I doing here. But if you really want to get you know, quick responses, Instagram, Instagram is the go to place.
Stephanie Moram 33:56
That's awesome. So thank you so much with us. So if you want to stay connected with me on Instagram, you can go to the Green Junkie Podcast and don't forget to subscribe to the Green Junkie Podcast on the platform you're listening on. If you're curious about zero waste, living sustainable fashion are wondering how to read food cleaning and product labels. I've totally got you covered. For direct access to me your green living expert, click the link in my show notes where you can ask me questions and get a customized plan on how you can live a greener life or hop on a one on one call with me or ask any questions via email. I will be your personal green Google and you can pick my brain. Hey, thank you, Camille for being here. I really, really appreciate it. Thank you for listening, and I'll see you next Tuesday.